Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

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Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby pitbull » Sat Jul 07, 2018 11:37 am

    

"We, representing the countries in the Miss Universe Pageant, in order to further the cause of international peace, justice, and mutual understanding, do solemnly dedicate ourselves to the highest ideals of sportsmanship, friendship and goodwill."


Many Miss Universe "fans" aka rabid animals are enraged at the fact that Angela Ponce will be representing Spain at Miss Universe. These rabid animals want her to step down because she is not a "real woman", I say so what? How many contestants do we see yearly going under the knife? *cough* VENEZUELA *Cough* in order to be beautiful? Normally I am against plastic surgery but when it comes to a personal choice, especially a sex change, I say ok, if that is how they identify who are we to judge. But others say that this is only for Natural women and that transexual people have their own pageant. That is true but when has Miss Universe excluded contestants? If we look back at its inception in 1952, back in an era that was predominantly racists against people of color, Miss Universe let women of color compete despite the constant racism that we see today. Heck even Trump had this to say:

“If there were too many women of color, he would make changes,” a Miss Universe staffer later noted. Another Miss Universe staffer recalled, “He often thought a woman was too ethnic or too dark-skinned. He had a particular type of woman he thought was a winner. Others were too ethnic. He liked a type. There was Olivia Culpo, Dayanara Torres [the 1993 winner], and, no surprise, East European women...



What I mean is that yes, transexual people have their own pageant, but pageants like Reina Hispanoamerica exists to aim at their Latino Audience as well as Miss Europe, Miss Asia-Pacific to aim at their perspective regions or other beauty pageants that aim for their personal cause.


Miss Universe has existed to empower women, but in an era that is changing at a faster speed, it is now safe to say that Miss Universe should evolve to include woman of all shapes, whether she be an endomorph (naturally curvy women) or an ectomorph (Miss Universe contestant prototype). Natural born or transexuals, the world is an everlasting change.

















P.S. advice to Angela Ponce, don't listen to these rabid animals and you be you!!!!! :hx :hx :hx :-* :-* :-* :-*


P.S.S Angela should tone down her make up as it makes her look frivolous, a softer look should make her more approachable. :-* :-* :-*



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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby MariaAndreina » Sat Jul 07, 2018 2:00 pm

Pretty sure Miss Universe doesn't allow married women, pregnant women, women who have had a child, and women over 28 to compete. :roll:
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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby pitbull » Sat Jul 07, 2018 2:10 pm

MariaAndreina wrote:Pretty sure Miss Universe doesn't allow married women, pregnant women, women who have had a child, and women over 28 to compete. :roll:


It can change over time :D/ :D/ :)>- :)>-

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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby sophocles » Sat Jul 07, 2018 2:27 pm

Following your logic, Ms. Universe should be open to women of all ages. No age limit should be imposed. If inclusion is being used as an excuse to include ex-men in Miss Universe, it is easier to imagine a grandmother joining miss Universe - at least she is a natural-born woman. That is empowerment!

What about allowing women ex-convicts to join? What about allowing women with head to toe tattoos and piercings? Or a woman who will wear only a burka during the entire competition to be sensitive to the sentiments of the Muslim population in the world? At least they are natural-born women, and they have the most essential attribute that make them more qualified to join Miss Universe than Angela Ponce.

I'm ok with Ponce joining Miss Universe, but her supporters and IMG should stop pretending that this is a big step for inclusion, when the truth is that this is an attention-seeking publicity stunt.

Even the Olympics have strict gender requirements, and no one is complaining that it is non-inclusive. There is a special Olympics for the disabled. No one is proposing that the disabled compete with mainstream athletes in the name of inclusion.

The very nature of a competition is discrimination and distinction. You discriminate and distinguish to find the individual that embodies the excellence that is envisioned by the organizing institution. It is the wrong place to advocate for inclusion. Besides, the LGBT community should not advocate for inclusion just so they can join beauty pageants, which are nothing but modern-day meat markets. It should advocate for inclusion so they can be represented in government, science, and the arts, and so they can live normal lives like everyone else.
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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby MariaAndreina » Sat Jul 07, 2018 2:57 pm

OK, I've stayed out of this issue for too long, mainly because the threads created with regards to this are mostly hate threads from people that are genuinely bothered by a transgender competing at Miss Universe. I am not. After all, this is a rule that the MUO implemented in 2012 and this was bound to happen sooner or later. Now, i didn't agree with it then and i dont agree with it now. However, the MUO decided to allow it and it is what it is.

As a disclaimer, i am all for transgender rights. As Olivia Culpo once said, "there's so many people out there who have a need to change for a happier life, i do accept that." However, transitioning from one gender to another does not automatically make this person the same as a naturally born woman. Now, people throw around multiple arguments to support this idea but I have yet to find one that actually justifies it.

The first one is, "gender is a social construct." Okay, but gender is also determined by the chromosomes you have. XX is for female, XY is for male. This means Angela Ponce has an X and Y chromosome. He was born male.

From here on, you get the counter argument that there are many other chromosome combinations than the ones listed. Okay, true, but those chromosome combinations mean mutations or disorders found on a human's body. Not a different kind of gender.

Then i've heard the argument that there are many animals and species that are able to be both male and female or that can transition from one gender to another. Great! But we are not the same as those species. Not to mention, those species are able to transition from gender to gender in a natural manner. In order for Angela Ponce to transition into a woman, unnatural procedures needed to be done.


At the end of the day, the definition itself says it all. transwoman. You transitioned into a woman.


And again, I'm very open in changing opinion so if anyone took the time to read this feel free to reply back with arguments that support transgenders being the same as naturally born but as of yet, i have not found anything other than being thrown the 'inclusion" card or I'm automatically labelled as transphobic or a bigot for not seeing things the other way.
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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby wokian2 » Sat Jul 07, 2018 3:03 pm

sophocles wrote:Following your logic, Ms. Universe should be open to women of all ages. No age limit should be imposed. If inclusion is being used as an excuse to include ex-men in Miss Universe, it is easier to imagine a grandmother joining miss Universe - at least she is a natural-born woman. That is empowerment!

What about allowing women ex-convicts to join? What about allowing women with head to toe tattoos and piercings? Or a woman who will wear only a burka during the entire competition to be sensitive to the sentiments of the Muslim population in the world? At least they are natural-born women, and they have the most essential attribute that make them more qualified to join Miss Universe than Angela Ponce.

I'm ok with Ponce joining Miss Universe, but her supporters and IMG should stop pretending that this is a big step for inclusion, when the truth is that this is an attention-seeking publicity stunt.

Even the Olympics have strict gender requirements, and no one is complaining that it is non-inclusive. There is a special Olympics for the disabled. No one is proposing that the disabled compete with mainstream athletes in the name of inclusion.

The very nature of a competition is discrimination and distinction. You discriminate and distinguish to find the individual that embodies the excellence that is envisioned by the organizing institution. It is the wrong place to advocate for inclusion. Besides, the LGBT community should not advocate for inclusion just so they can join beauty pageants, which are nothing but modern-day meat markets. It should advocate for inclusion so they can be represented in government, science, and the arts, and so they can live normal lives like everyone else.


spot on.

inclusion in Miss Universe is asking too much, going too far and being insensitve. Its always not about LGBT. There are things we need to preserve.
LGBT should also respect the other member of the ecosystem. Do they care if there are people that feel uncomfortable changing the norm? Acceptance and tolerance has already been given.
Trans should still be considered as "third sex" rather than women. Term 'women' is often abused, i think it should stick to the term based on natural basis (like ability to conceive a child) and number of chromosomes. Not on simply on physical features. Identifying them as "third sex" would establish a better acceptance in the long run. But it is still unclear how events like Olympics and statistical census can adopt with this.
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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby sophocles » Sat Jul 07, 2018 3:40 pm

An honest conversation about Angela Ponce is not possible because the moment you express your disagreement, half of the LGBT community will label you a bigot. The facts are:
1.) Angela Ponce is a transwoman.
2.) IMG owns Miss Universe, and it has allowed transwomen to compete in Miss Universe.
3.) Angela competed in her home country, and earned the right to represent it in Miss Universe.

While Angela can compete in Miss Universe, people should be able to discuss the merits and repercussions of this decision. I predict there will be a backlash. This is a big gamble for the LGBT community, and I wish it was for a cause higher than the right to sashay in swimsuit and evening gown in a beauty pageant. I'm sure there are transsexuals out there who are discriminated or harassed at work, denied a mortgage, or denied service in a public facility. Any of these cases would have been more worthy of the fight and spotlight, than a transwoman competing with natural born women in a swimsuit competition.

Incidentally, Trump has been trying hard of late to frame himself as a true-blue conservative. He is bent on nominating a new SC justice who will vote to overturn Roe v. Wade. I wonder how he will explain his decision in 2012, before he decided to run for office, to allow transwomen to compete in Miss Universe?
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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby manoypoe » Sat Jul 07, 2018 3:57 pm

WHOEVER WRITE THIS PIECE OF SHIT - IS THE RABID ANIMAL HIMSELF INTOLERANT OF ANY DISSENTING OPINON. [-X [-X :%)) :%))
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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby krissynelli » Sat Jul 07, 2018 4:11 pm

"INCLUSION" IS SUCH AN OVERUSED AND MISPLACED WORD IN THE LGBT COMMUNITY!....#FEELINGentitled 8-} 8-} 8-} 8-} 8-} 8-} 8-} 8-}
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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby Pacifico » Sat Jul 07, 2018 4:29 pm

Angela Ponce was born male. Her DNA will say that she is a male. However, she chose to change her genital, so she is now a transwoman, not a woman. Two different things. Seriously, it's not a rocket science; you dont have to explain in such a long post why she must go. It's just not acceptable.
If you are wondering why Miss Universe is losing its relevance and not getting more buzz, this is it. MUO is trying so much to put SJW value about inclusiveness, and honestly it's a flop!
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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby IanC062 » Sat Jul 07, 2018 4:35 pm

I just feel Angela Ponce should go to Miss Universe because the rules allow her to compete and she won the right via being crowned Miss Universo Spain 2018. Personally, I don't have a problem with it and I have no problem with other people having a problem with it, as long as they are articulate and not downright insulting which is what some people are on this portal.

I don't throw around words like 'Transphobic', for the same reason I don't use 'Islamophobia'. They are just non-words to shut down debate. I do think there are a hell of a lot of bigots on this portal though, who have really come up out of the woodwork lately, by saying that because she doesn't have ovaries she isn't a woman ? That's like saying that Angelina Jolie isn't a woman because she had a mastectomy.

Now, to throw my spanner in the works...do I think Angela Ponce should have won her national pageant ? It is hard to say. On beauty, nah, not so much. I don't think she is crazy beautiful or anything. Andrea de las Heras was much more beautiful. I didn't watch the pageant, as I can only speak English, so I'll leave it up to Spanish speakers to determine if she was the best of the night.

Simply put, I just think people need to get over it. She WILL be standing up there with all the other competitors and if I was a betting man, she will reach the Top 10 at maximum. She won't win though. That crown is reserved for either Philippines or South Africa.
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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby IanC062 » Sat Jul 07, 2018 4:37 pm

MariaAndreina wrote:OK, I've stayed out of this issue for too long, mainly because the threads created with regards to this are mostly hate threads from people that are genuinely bothered by a transgender competing at Miss Universe. I am not. After all, this is a rule that the MUO implemented in 2012 and this was bound to happen sooner or later. Now, i didn't agree with it then and i dont agree with it now. However, the MUO decided to allow it and it is what it is.

As a disclaimer, i am all for transgender rights. As Olivia Culpo once said, "there's so many people out there who have a need to change for a happier life, i do accept that." However, transitioning from one gender to another does not automatically make this person the same as a naturally born woman. Now, people throw around multiple arguments to support this idea but I have yet to find one that actually justifies it.

The first one is, "gender is a social construct." Okay, but gender is also determined by the chromosomes you have. XX is for female, XY is for male. This means Angela Ponce has an X and Y chromosome. He was born male.

From here on, you get the counter argument that there are many other chromosome combinations than the ones listed. Okay, true, but those chromosome combinations mean mutations or disorders found on a human's body. Not a different kind of gender.

Then i've heard the argument that there are many animals and species that are able to be both male and female or that can transition from one gender to another. Great! But we are not the same as those species. Not to mention, those species are able to transition from gender to gender in a natural manner. In order for Angela Ponce to transition into a woman, unnatural procedures needed to be done.


At the end of the day, the definition itself says it all. transwoman. You transitioned into a woman.


And again, I'm very open in changing opinion so if anyone took the time to read this feel free to reply back with arguments that support transgenders being the same as naturally born but as of yet, i have not found anything other than being thrown the 'inclusion" card or I'm automatically labelled as transphobic or a bigot for not seeing things the other way.


I disagree with you, buddy, but thanks for not spewing hate and for using your intelligence to articulate this post. If more people acted with the decorum that you do, this would be a healthier place for productive conversations.
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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby krissynelli » Sat Jul 07, 2018 4:45 pm

"INCLUSIVITY" SHOULD APPLY ALSO TO ABOVE 28 WOMEN, OVER 200 POUNDS GIRLS, HANDICAPPED AND MARRIED WOMEN...LET THEM COMPETE FIRST; BEFORE THE TRANSGENDER...THEIR'S DISCRIMINATION ALSO TO WHOM SHALL BE GIVEN---"INCLUSIVITY" ...IT DOESN'T REVOLVE AROUND THE LGBT COMMUNITY! >:)
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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby ManMeat » Sat Jul 07, 2018 4:51 pm

Miss Universe pageant isn't Miss Genital Universe, Miss DNA Universe, Miss Fertile Universe
Angela deserves to go to Miss Universe
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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby NhokShjn » Sat Jul 07, 2018 5:08 pm

wokian2 wrote:
sophocles wrote:Following your logic, Ms. Universe should be open to women of all ages. No age limit should be imposed. If inclusion is being used as an excuse to include ex-men in Miss Universe, it is easier to imagine a grandmother joining miss Universe - at least she is a natural-born woman. That is empowerment!

What about allowing women ex-convicts to join? What about allowing women with head to toe tattoos and piercings? Or a woman who will wear only a burka during the entire competition to be sensitive to the sentiments of the Muslim population in the world? At least they are natural-born women, and they have the most essential attribute that make them more qualified to join Miss Universe than Angela Ponce.

I'm ok with Ponce joining Miss Universe, but her supporters and IMG should stop pretending that this is a big step for inclusion, when the truth is that this is an attention-seeking publicity stunt.

Even the Olympics have strict gender requirements, and no one is complaining that it is non-inclusive. There is a special Olympics for the disabled. No one is proposing that the disabled compete with mainstream athletes in the name of inclusion.

The very nature of a competition is discrimination and distinction. You discriminate and distinguish to find the individual that embodies the excellence that is envisioned by the organizing institution. It is the wrong place to advocate for inclusion. Besides, the LGBT community should not advocate for inclusion just so they can join beauty pageants, which are nothing but modern-day meat markets. It should advocate for inclusion so they can be represented in government, science, and the arts, and so they can live normal lives like everyone else.


spot on.

inclusion in Miss Universe is asking too much, going too far and being insensitve. Its always not about LGBT. There are things we need to preserve.
LGBT should also respect the other member of the ecosystem. Do they care if there are people that feel uncomfortable changing the norm? Acceptance and tolerance has already been given.
Trans should still be considered as "third sex" rather than women. Term 'women' is often abused, i think it should stick to the term based on natural basis (like ability to conceive a child) and number of chromosomes. Not on simply on physical features. Identifying them as "third sex" would establish a better acceptance in the long run. But it is still unclear how events like Olympics and statistical census can adopt with this.


Lmaooo are y'all really comparing this situation to the Olympics?? Sports are different, women physically and biologically are not as strong as men if we disregard training. And for sure athletes with disability don't have all physical capabilities as other athletes, so for now the Paralympics exits. But they are actually thinking of merging both in the future. Some disabled athletes have competed in the Olympics, and they were praised for it.

Now in Miss Universe which is about aesthetics, you don't need physical abilities, you need to be commercially pretty and be able to speak and influence. Until a Miss Universe has to be able to give birth to win, transgender women don't have any biological constraint that prevent them from competing fairly.

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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby lunica » Sat Jul 07, 2018 5:10 pm

sophocles wrote:Following your logic, Ms. Universe should be open to women of all ages. No age limit should be imposed. If inclusion is being used as an excuse to include ex-men in Miss Universe, it is easier to imagine a grandmother joining miss Universe - at least she is a natural-born woman. That is empowerment!

What about allowing women ex-convicts to join? What about allowing women with head to toe tattoos and piercings? Or a woman who will wear only a burka during the entire competition to be sensitive to the sentiments of the Muslim population in the world? At least they are natural-born women, and they have the most essential attribute that make them more qualified to join Miss Universe than Angela Ponce.

I'm ok with Ponce joining Miss Universe, but her supporters and IMG should stop pretending that this is a big step for inclusion, when the truth is that this is an attention-seeking publicity stunt.

Even the Olympics have strict gender requirements, and no one is complaining that it is non-inclusive. There is a special Olympics for the disabled. No one is proposing that the disabled compete with mainstream athletes in the name of inclusion.

The very nature of a competition is discrimination and distinction. You discriminate and distinguish to find the individual that embodies the excellence that is envisioned by the organizing institution. It is the wrong place to advocate for inclusion. Besides, the LGBT community should not advocate for inclusion just so they can join beauty pageants, which are nothing but modern-day meat markets. It should advocate for inclusion so they can be represented in government, science, and the arts, and so they can live normal lives like everyone else.


ah how i love this speech, although i would remove the first part of the third paragraph.
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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby Hu Yu Hai Ding » Sat Jul 07, 2018 5:39 pm

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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby ZELINA » Sat Jul 07, 2018 5:44 pm

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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby Agnes Rosenberg » Sat Jul 07, 2018 5:46 pm

TO ALL THE UGLY HATERS HERE IN MISSO......

HAVE ANY TRANSGENDER DO SOMETHING BAD TO YOU?
SO FROM WHERE DOES ALL YOUR HATE COMING FROM? @-) =O/ @-)

AND WHAT ARE YOU ALL FIGHTING FOR? :-O :-O :-O
TO MALIGN US THE TRANSGENDERS? =O/ =O/ =O/

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Be careful who you hate. It could be someone you love.

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[quote="Agnes Rosenberg"]
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SOME PEOPLE ARE LESBIAN, GAY,
BISEXUAL, TRANSGENDER... GET OVER IT.
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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby Charlota Gayle Zachberd » Sat Jul 07, 2018 5:48 pm

Hoy LALAKENG baklang nag paretoke ng hotdog at betlog wag masyadong ILUSYONADA... Lakaki kang pinanganak at lalaki ka pa ring mamatay kahit lagyan mo pa ng dalawang suso yang dibdib mo at palitan mo pa ng pekpeks yang harapan mo.

Kaya magtigil ka AGNES, wag masyadong ambisyosa at wag lokohin ang sarili... ALAM MO SA SARILI MONG LALAKE KA... aminin mo, ginamit mo yang hotdog na yan habang pinagpapantasyahan at nagbabati ka dun sa mga lalakeng crush mo nuon.

Baklang toh, feeling gurl ampoootahhh
>:) >:) >:) >:) >:) >:)


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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby ZELINA » Sat Jul 07, 2018 5:50 pm

Hayyys nakuah Mareng Charlotah, wag mo ng pinagpapansin yang Ilusyonadang Agnes na yan... Sa totoo lang eh nabubuhay ang mga yan sa HORMONES... subukan mong wag mag iniksyon yang ng 1 buwan ng hormones... babalik ang mga muscle at bigote nyan at higit sa lahat eh LALAKE ULET MGA BOSES NYAN... kalokahhhh yang mga baklang yan... MASYADONG AMBISYOSA... WALA NAMAN SA LUGAR... ewwwwwwwwwww @-) @-) @-) @-) @-) @-) @-)

Ohhh eto si Charice, este si Jake Zyrus,,,, bagay kayong dalawa,
pareho kayong NAGPATAPYAS NG MGA ORGANS NYO >:) >:) >:)

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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby Ligaya Magdalena » Sat Jul 07, 2018 5:52 pm

Ligaya Magdalena wrote:
Focpoclou Wang wrote:Kalokahhhhh.... NAGKAKAUBUSAN NA BA NG MGA GAY PAGEANTS.... kaya pati yung dapat na para lang sa mga TUNAY na babae eh talagang ipagpilitan ng iba nating kapatid na bakla na salihan. :-O :-O :-O Dreaming is ok but being delusioned is NOT... Kahit isang libong opera pa ipagawa niyo dyan sa mga katawan niyo.... ORIGINALLY, you were conceived and born as MALE... mga ambisyosang froglets..... =O/ =O/ =O/

Agnes Rosenberg wrote: @Focpoc Louwang.....Hoy baklang panget na may katawan na singlaki ng sa elepante...... DONT US... Hindi namin kasalanan kung pinanganak kaming maganda, payat, makinis at mukhang babae. [-X Pera at panahon namin ang ginagamit namin sa pagpapalagay ng suso at pekpekk kaya WALA KAYONG PAKIALAM. [-X

Mamatay kayo sa ingget mga baklang CHAKA. :-j Baket ba BITTER na BITTER kayo sa aming magagandang bakla. At baket bawal kaming sumali sa mga female beauty pageants, bakeetttt, INSECURE na ba yung mga bilat nyong kandidata sa malaDiyosa naming kagandahan dahil ba sa mas maganda pa kami sa kanila.

Haleeeerrr, INGGIT MUCH TO THE MAX ang mga peg nyo.... PALIBHASA MGA SAKSAKAN NG PANGET KAYO!!! @-) =O/ @-)

Ateng Agnes, tingin ko eh wala namang umaaway sayo. Ganyan talaga ang buhay, hindi natin control ang sasabihin at gugustuhin ng ibang tao. Kung karapatan mong ipaglaban ang rights mo bilang Transgender eh karapatan din nilang sabihin ang opinyon nila maging tama man ito o mali sa paniniwala mo. :-*

Relax lang ateng... dapat nga happy ka na dahil mismong IMG na ang tumatanggap para makasali ang mga Transgender sa Miss Universe Pageant... Ohhh debahhhhh napakalaking development na yan... CHEER UP... Maganda ka at mayaman at edukada.... Look at me,,, mahirap, panget at di nakatapos sa college, pero I AM HAPPY AND CONTENTED with what God has given me. :O)

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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby Hazel Anne Mariposa » Sat Jul 07, 2018 5:56 pm

COME ON MADAM AGNES AND LETS FIGHT THESE UGLY IDIOT, UNEDUCATED,
NARROW MINDED, JUDGEMENTAL, UNLOVING, RACIST BIGOT HERE IN MISSO. :-j :-j :-j

TRANSGENDERS ARE MORE BEAUTIFUL THAN YOUR SO CALLED NATURAL BORN WOMEN...... STOP YOUR BITTER INSECURITIES AND JEALOUSY... IT IS SO PATHETIC. @-) @-) @-) Kaya Ate Diyosa Agnes, hayaan mo na lang na mamatay sa inggit yang mga panget na baklang mga yan. :%)) :%)) :%))

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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby MAGNETO » Sat Jul 07, 2018 5:59 pm

I am with you Agnes.
Lets RISE ABOVE HATE :-*
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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby Preciosa Mapagbigay » Sat Jul 07, 2018 6:03 pm

Please don't hate our 'Our Trans Sisters as they
don't hate you and they dont do anything wrong to you.



You don't know what they are going through...



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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby valleriam » Sat Jul 07, 2018 6:11 pm

I get why many people have an issue with her joining the pageant, but I just don't agree with some of the arguments I've read in this forum, mainly because they seem too vague and coming just from a very selfish stand point, rather than looking at the bigger picture. My thing is, there have been girls competing with multiple surgeries and enhancements since the early years of Miss Universe. Therefore, Angela is no different. She's a woman born in a male body that did what she had to do to correct that. Just like many others were born with big noses, big chins, thin lips, small boobs, and they did what they had to do to correct those "flaws" and get noticed. I guess I'm just too open minded, but the bottom line is that this was supposed to happen sooner or later, she is not breaking any rules.
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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby Agnes Rosenberg » Sat Jul 07, 2018 6:42 pm

Unless you have seen a day through my eyes, unless you have listened through my ears,
unless you have walked a day in my shoes, don’t even begin to judge or criticize me.

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SOME PEOPLE ARE LESBIAN, GAY,
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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby unbreakable » Sat Jul 07, 2018 7:24 pm

I don't have a problem with Angela Competing in Miss universe . But she should be judged FAIRLY like the other Contestants . :)>-


I hope i won't offend anyone by saying this , but Almost all Transgender I've seen have masculine faces and bodies, so I don't see how Transgender Contestants will be able to make the Cut if they are being judged fairly :,?? :,??
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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby sleuth08 » Sat Jul 07, 2018 8:17 pm

RIGHT NOW MISS UNIVERSE IS TRENDING ALL OVER THE WORLD BECAUSE OF ANGELA PONCE. IF ANGELA WILL CONTINUE TO PERSUE HER DREAMS IT WILL DRAW A LOT OF VIEWERS NOT JUST IN THE U.S. BUT ALL OVER THE WORLD TO SEE HOW WELL SHE WILL COMPETE AND POSSIBLE PLACEMENT
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Re: Why Angela Ponce MUST go to Miss Universe!

Postby wokian2 » Sat Jul 07, 2018 10:15 pm

krissynelli wrote:"INCLUSIVITY" SHOULD APPLY ALSO TO ABOVE 28 WOMEN, OVER 200 POUNDS GIRLS, HANDICAPPED AND MARRIED WOMEN...LET THEM COMPETE FIRST; BEFORE THE TRANSGENDER...THEIR'S DISCRIMINATION ALSO TO WHOM SHALL BE GIVEN---"INCLUSIVITY" ...IT DOESN'T REVOLVE AROUND THE LGBT COMMUNITY! >:)

MariaAndreina wrote:Pretty sure Miss Universe doesn't allow married women, pregnant women, women who have had a child, and women over 28 to compete. :roll:



Married women - "Miss" wont apply anymore
Pregnant women - unless not married, can be allowed. But can they do the job?
Unmarried women over 28 even with a child/children, as long as unmarried - should be able to be allowed first. I am more open to see a 40-year old empowered female to promote feminity and be a role model to young girls, young women, aspiring males of becoming a woman, and universal human population.

NhokShjn wrote:
wokian2 wrote:
sophocles wrote:Following your logic, Ms. Universe should be open to women of all ages. No age limit should be imposed. If inclusion is being used as an excuse to include ex-men in Miss Universe, it is easier to imagine a grandmother joining miss Universe - at least she is a natural-born woman. That is empowerment!

What about allowing women ex-convicts to join? What about allowing women with head to toe tattoos and piercings? Or a woman who will wear only a burka during the entire competition to be sensitive to the sentiments of the Muslim population in the world? At least they are natural-born women, and they have the most essential attribute that make them more qualified to join Miss Universe than Angela Ponce.

I'm ok with Ponce joining Miss Universe, but her supporters and IMG should stop pretending that this is a big step for inclusion, when the truth is that this is an attention-seeking publicity stunt.

Even the Olympics have strict gender requirements, and no one is complaining that it is non-inclusive. There is a special Olympics for the disabled. No one is proposing that the disabled compete with mainstream athletes in the name of inclusion.

The very nature of a competition is discrimination and distinction. You discriminate and distinguish to find the individual that embodies the excellence that is envisioned by the organizing institution. It is the wrong place to advocate for inclusion. Besides, the LGBT community should not advocate for inclusion just so they can join beauty pageants, which are nothing but modern-day meat markets. It should advocate for inclusion so they can be represented in government, science, and the arts, and so they can live normal lives like everyone else.


spot on.

inclusion in Miss Universe is asking too much, going too far and being insensitve. Its always not about LGBT. There are things we need to preserve.
LGBT should also respect the other member of the ecosystem. Do they care if there are people that feel uncomfortable changing the norm? Acceptance and tolerance has already been given.
Trans should still be considered as "third sex" rather than women. Term 'women' is often abused, i think it should stick to the term based on natural basis (like ability to conceive a child) and number of chromosomes. Not on simply on physical features. Identifying them as "third sex" would establish a better acceptance in the long run. But it is still unclear how events like Olympics and statistical census can adopt with this.


Lmaooo are y'all really comparing this situation to the Olympics?? Sports are different, women physically and biologically are not as strong as men if we disregard training. And for sure athletes with disability don't have all physical capabilities as other athletes, so for now the Paralympics exits. But they are actually thinking of merging both in the future. Some disabled athletes have competed in the Olympics, and they were praised for it.

Now in Miss Universe which is about aesthetics, you don't need physical abilities, you need to be commercially pretty and be able to speak and influence. Until a Miss Universe has to be able to give birth to win, transgender women don't have any biological constraint that prevent them from competing fairly.

Question?


we cannot be double sworded on not lloking at Olympics. If you want to ignore gender as means of classification, then dont overlook olympics. Olympics events are classified as MEN's and WOMEN's events, rather than (MALE or FEMALE) (example MEN's Basketball or WOMEN's Basketball) A male transexual woman is a "WOMAN" but still a biological MALE.

It makes perfect sense that a transwoman cannot join a woman's team, because of physical strength as pointed out. The same logic is for Miss Universe, we use the basis of their natural female characteristics (her experiences as a small girl, her struggles/triumphs growing as an adolescent and as a woman which are all dictated by her natural hormones and this is the exclusive ingredient for her to become a perfect role model to other young girls and other women). Which now makes me agree more that Miss Universe should remove the age limit totally.

Now in Miss Universe which is about aesthetics, you don't need physical abilities, you need to be commercially pretty and be able to speak and influence. Until a Miss Universe has to be able to give birth to win, transgender women don't have any biological constraint that prevent them from competing fairly.


Its more than beauty. Its not just about be able to speak.

Its where the influence will be coming from from within, how can a transwoman be a role model and influence young women and girls if she do not understand the real struggles and didnt experience it first hand? The experience and lessons that only a true natural woman can deliver, "sincerely and hollistically".

That is why Transsexuals needs their own pageant, to inspire and influence aspiring transexuals, address the real struggle they are facing and influence as perfectly as they can. In the same manner, natural females cannot address the real struggles transexuals are facing.
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