CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

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CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby firerprince » Sat Jun 30, 2018 3:31 am

    

DISCLAIMER: Not a hate thread. This topic is created to openly tackle Cultural Relativism and Transphobia.



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For the first time in MISS UNIVERSE's history, a transsexual woman is set to compete at the biggest stage of Pageants. A stage wherein a natural born male has never graced. Her name is Angela Ponce and she is all set to represent Spain in the global stage.


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RE: A VERY "SUBJECTIVE" HISTORIC MOMENT.

While many are applauding this moment, Huge amount of violent reactions are escalating online. Leading to debates and confrontations as to whose contention is right and should be accepted. Some says, it's a progressive movement for the LGBTQ community as well as in Pageantry while some believes that it is the beginning of an end for Miss Universe. We will never reach a final conclusion as to what's right or wrong but one thing is for sure GOOD OR BAD PUBLICITY is PUBLICITY so kudos to ORGBEMISS (Miss Universe Spain Organization) for howling attention worldwide.


RE: TRANSPHOBIA AND CULTURAL RELATIVISM


DEFINITION:
Transphobia is a range of negative attitudes, feelings or actions toward transgender or transsexual people, or toward transsexuality. Transphobia can be emotional disgust, fear, violence, anger, or discomfort felt or expressed towards people who do not conform to society's gender expectation



DEFINITION:
Cultural Relativism is the view that moral or ethical systems, which vary from culture to culture, are all equally valid and no one system is really “better” than any other. Cultural relativism is a widely held position in the modern world. Words like “pluralism,” “tolerance,” and “acceptance” have taken on new meanings, as the boundaries of “culture” have expanded.


Indeed we are in a time where acceptance and tolerance transcended norm and culture BUT we can never deny the fact that there are still conservative groups of people who follow their cultural standard in viewing situations like this.
Most of the western people would definitely applaud this news but not in certain traditionalist parts of the world specifically the ASIAN REGION.
Let me set Philippines as an example: Filipinos celebrates pageants in almost every social gathering available (Schools, Fiestas, etc..). Later on,
there came GAY BEAUTY PAGEANTS! In a society where both FEMALE and GAY/TRANSSEXUAL beauty pageants coincides...Filipinos learned to differentiate the value for both pageants, making a norm that FEMALE BEAUTY PAGEANTS is an exclusive competition for natural born women anchored on respect and celebration of femininity while GAY/TRANSSEXUAL PAGEANTS as another exclusive competition for natural born man anchored on entertainment and celebration of the LGBTQ rights. Both pageant co-exists HARMONIOUSLY for a different purpose and objective. So never in the history of the conservative Philippines that a natural born male breaks into Female beauty pageants vice versa (because they have their own platform from the beginning).
Therefore, Miss Universe as the alpha/biggest female pageant for Filipinos (as much as what the norm suggests) should only be participated by natural born women otherwise it will destroy the norm they have in their pageantry's individual image of FEMALE and GAY beauty contests.

So we cannot just argue that people who opposes this movement are automatically Transphobic and close minded since their beliefs are strongly anchored on what their culture shows them. This is the reason on why you would see tons of comments paving respect for the LGBTQ community but at the same time opposes to the idea of a Transgender joining Female Pageants.


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RE: MISS UNIVERSE'S REPUTATION AMIDST THE ISSUE

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A lot are advocating for Angela's dethronement or disqualification for the coming competition suggesting that MUO should prohibit her from joining as they don't see her participation fit and decent to do so. But as pageant fans we all know that MUO under Donald Trump cleared this issue way back in 2012 allowing Transgenders to finally join his pageant. The only way for Angela to be stopped is for MUO to revise its rules unfavorable on the part of the Transgender in which is a very timely-stupid move that MUO will never resort into. Furthermore, Miss Universe is known to be an advocate for LGBT rights..to deny Angela a pass is purely Hypocritical.



In my humble opinion, MUO should accept Angela with open arms (to do otherwise is a bigger blow to their reputation). Inevitably, Angela will generate massive attention (good or bad) for the pageant so my only wish is for MUO to treat Angela fairly and not exclusively. I've seen her performance in Miss Universe Spain, I must say it's underwhelming therefore quite obvious that the crown was rigged in her favor. In connection to that, MUO should definitely highlight her momentous story but NEVER EVER give her an unfair edge over deserving girls! If happens will probably put Angela and MUO's reputation to a greater death.



Just recently, MISSOSOLOGY created a POLL to feel the fans' pulse regarding this issue.

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RE: THE WOMEN OF THE HOUR




I admire her bravery and perseverance in pursuing the thing she likes the most, PAGEANTRY. Indeed Angela is the name that all pageant aficionados would remember for the rest of time. There will be massive attacks online or even in person and I just wish this wonderful lady a happy and positive reign as the first ever TRANSGENDER MISS. :-* GOODLUCK to her in MISS UNIVERSE! =c3


Last edited by firerprince on Sat Jun 30, 2018 4:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby Smile » Sat Jun 30, 2018 4:01 am

She'll be fine.

Transgendered people are very courageous. Criticism is not going to affect her. Transgenders in pageants are even more courageous because it takes a lot of courage to get on that stage and be judged when much of the world hasn't accepted you.

The type of bullying that she has most certainly already faced in her personal life plus in her pageant life has prepared her well for this moment.

There will be ignorant people, many of them here, but it's important for her to know that the people who matter have accepted her.
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby chorr » Sat Jun 30, 2018 4:05 am

Not to antagonize the thread, but I would just like to reiterate, as you have said that pageants here in the Philippines have different purposes and objectives. Let's face it, the pageants for women are what celebrates a woman's grace and femininity while the pageants for the LGBTQ+ are just to poke fun and make them butt of laughter and jokes. This on its own negate the statement that we are living in time where acceptance is a norm. We, the LGBTQ as a whole and not just our trans sisters are still being tolerated and given the bare minimun; for acceptance means totality of the being - what the other person thinks, sees and feels about her self, and not making it about ourselves or our beliefs.

Live and let live.

I would like to qoute Jenna Talackova with my stance regarding this:

“I have never asked for any special consideration. I only wanted to compete,”


Angela probably is just asking for the same. Let her compete. While it might seem that that the Miss Spain Universe cooked everything in her favor, that would not be the case for the Miss Universe itself.

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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby The Duchess » Sat Jun 30, 2018 4:09 am

I'm sorry but one thing is saying "Yo, I don't like this" and another is the actual bullying this woman has received for weeks. When you are calling her a shemale, a man, taking about penises and saying she is this or that is bullying.

Asian culture may be conservative but Miss Universe is an american liberal pageant, they shouldn't have to go agaisnt what they believe just to please conservatives. If they do that then they are weak. And just because you are conservative doesnt make it okay to say certain thing.

She doesnt want to be in an exclusive trans pageants, she wants to be a Miss Universe. Why is everyone acting like its wrong for her to want that?

Follow a more conservative, only ciswomen pageant if that makes people more comfortable but dont be attacking someone who applied to a pageant she qualified for.
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby firerprince » Sat Jun 30, 2018 4:33 am

The Duchess wrote:I'm sorry but one thing is saying "Yo, I don't like this" and another is the actual bullying this woman has received for weeks. When you are calling her a shemale, a man, taking about penises and saying she is this or that is bullying.

And just becauseyou are conservative doesnt make it okay to say certain thing.


Be careful on how you address "YOU" in this thread. If your intention is to call me out then hey! you're barking up the wrong tree.
I created the thread to explain in the best of my ability the reason behind people opposing her win (not her) that it's not all about transphobia but something has to do with culture. Never that it means I am on the bench of those who criticize. I will never resort to bashing or to any hideous name calling as you mentioned.
Yes, I disagreed with Taleen's (Miss Israel Finalist) participation but that was months back.. Now I'm totally fine with a transgender competing at my long loved pageant, Miss Universe. I forgot to make it clear above that I'm actually supporting Angela... I thought that would be understood from the context of my last Phrases in the topic.


P.S. Now I inserted a disclaimer :=p
Last edited by firerprince on Sat Jun 30, 2018 4:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby The Duchess » Sat Jun 30, 2018 4:39 am

firerprince wrote:
The Duchess wrote:I'm sorry but one thing is saying "Yo, I don't like this" and another is the actual bullying this woman has received for weeks. When you are calling her a shemale, a man, taking about penises and saying she is this or that is bullying.

And just becauseyou are conservative doesnt make it okay to say certain thing.


Be careful on how you address "YOU" in this thread. If your intention is to call me out then hey! you're barking up the wrong tree.
I created the thread to explain in the best of my ability the reason behind people opposing her win (not her) that it's not all about transphobia but something has to do with culture. Never that it means I am on the bench of those who criticize. I will never resort to bashing or to any hideous name calling as you mentioned.
Yes, I disagreed with Taleen's (Miss Israel Finalist) participation but that was months back.. Now I'm totally fine with a transgender competing at my long loved pageant, Miss Universe. I forgot to make it clear above that I'm actually supporting Angela... I thought that would be understood from the context of my last Phrases in the topic.


You can use YOU without adressing a specific person on the english language, I didnt say your name or quoted you or anything of the sort. If I wanted to adress you specifically I would have made it extremely clear yet I didnt.
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby firerprince » Sat Jun 30, 2018 4:53 am

The Duchess wrote:
firerprince wrote:
The Duchess wrote:I'm sorry but one thing is saying "Yo, I don't like this" and another is the actual bullying this woman has received for weeks. When you are calling her a shemale, a man, taking about penises and saying she is this or that is bullying.

And just becauseyou are conservative doesnt make it okay to say certain thing.


Be careful on how you address "YOU" in this thread. If your intention is to call me out then hey! you're barking up the wrong tree.
I created the thread to explain in the best of my ability the reason behind people opposing her win (not her) that it's not all about transphobia but something has to do with culture. Never that it means I am on the bench of those who criticize. I will never resort to bashing or to any hideous name calling as you mentioned.
Yes, I disagreed with Taleen's (Miss Israel Finalist) participation but that was months back.. Now I'm totally fine with a transgender competing at my long loved pageant, Miss Universe. I forgot to make it clear above that I'm actually supporting Angela... I thought that would be understood from the context of my last Phrases in the topic.


You can use YOU without adressing a specific person on the english language, I didnt say your name or quoted you or anything of the sort. If I wanted to adress you specifically I would have made it extremely clear yet I didnt.


That's why I said "be careful" and "if" ;/)) It's purely hypothetical in nature.
For someone who commented with vast aggressiveness It's normal for me react and clear my side specially when the recipient of your contention is that ambiguous. Maybe not your intention but care to feel what the readers would think.
And oh, it's not that hard to clear things up.
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby pineal » Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:12 am

chorr wrote:Not to antagonize the thread, but I would just like to reiterate, as you have said that pageants here in the Philippines have different purposes and objectives. Let's face it, the pageants for women are what celebrates a woman's grace and femininity while the pageants for the LGBTQ+ are just to poke fun and make them butt of laughter and jokes. This on its own negate the statement that we are living in time where acceptance is a norm. We, the LGBTQ as a whole and not just our trans sisters are still being tolerated and given the bare minimun; for acceptance means totality of the being - what the other person thinks, sees and feels about her self, and not making it about ourselves or our beliefs.

Live and let live.

I would like to qoute Jenna Talackova with my stance regarding this:

“I have never asked for any special consideration. I only wanted to compete,”


Angela probably is just asking for the same. Let her compete. While it might seem that that the Miss Spain Universe cooked everything in her favor, that would not be the case for the Miss Universe itself.


I completely agree, pushing people to fringes of society does not mean acceptance. A trans person deserves the acceptance of their identity and not just tolerance of their existence. It's not a matter of opinion, it's a matter of treating someone with the same respect as everyone else. People are born in cultures which teach them prejudice, but everyone can learn and grow to appreciate humanity without any pre-conceived notions. Everyone deserves to live a happy respectful life, and seeing a Trans person on Miss Universe stage will inspire them to not think any less of themselves, as society has made them believe.
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby novemberRain » Sat Jun 30, 2018 11:02 am

Transphobia? Transs have their own pageants, if he insists to compete and won Miss Universe 2018, you make beauty pageant image is getting worst especially in my country, Miss Universe is well known for natural born women, YOU DISGRACE YOURSELF BECAUSE YOU RUIN OUR TRADITION.
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby The Duchess » Sat Jun 30, 2018 3:00 pm

novemberRain wrote:Transphobia? Transs have their own pageants, if he insists to compete and won Miss Universe 2018, you make beauty pageant image is getting worst especially in my country, Miss Universe is well known for natural born women, YOU DISGRACE YOURSELF BECAUSE YOU RUIN OUR TRADITION.


I'm sorry but neither she nor Miss Universe have to forgo their pageant policy because some countries are conservative. Nobody has to follow or mantain another country's traditions, nor we are a disgrace if we dont follow them or help you follow it. You cannot control how all countries will see you, some will aplaud you and some wont. You can't make everyone happy and that's something they know, they will cater to the type of audience they want. This organization is very pro LGBT therefore you will keep seeing things like this in this pageant. Theres more conservative pageants people can follow if they dont want to watch a more liberal pageant.
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby Virginia Dalisay » Sat Jun 30, 2018 3:26 pm

For me, i don't agree for the Trans to join FEMALE beauty pageants. But for the sake of "LOVE AND WORLD PEACE", i guess we can negotiate it and meet halfway... Life is short, wag maging madamot sa konting kaligayahan ng ibang tao... AND I THANK YOU... chosssssssssss... =;)) =;)) =;)) =;)) =;)) =;)) =;)) =;)) =;)) =;)) =;)) =;)) >:) >:) >:) <:-P
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby poker_man » Sat Jun 30, 2018 3:40 pm

Whatever that creature is should not be allowed. Imagine the face of Steve Harvey if he interviews that creature! =0 =0 =0

If that creature is allowed to step on stage as a Miss Universe contestant then we can have anyone straight and gay men, married and old women compete for Miss Universe as well. >:< >:< >:<
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby gaara225 » Sat Jun 30, 2018 4:03 pm

she will go be proud and be the talk of the town and overshadowing the so called favorite and hyped to death contestants. She may not place but like miss Iraq she will have her own segment and be the star of the pageant. the Spanish org knows that they wont win this year or in 10 so why not make headlines, this will open doors to unique and different contestants for the years to come. and that's a refreshing thing considering the pageant has like 5 doppelgangers this year
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby cindy kurletopz 2 » Sat Jun 30, 2018 5:06 pm

I am a gay man and i do not agree to a transgender woman competing for a pageant inclusive to female by birth and by dna. this is not about gender segregation this is about respect beyond gender labeling and teritorial arena. When a transgender competes for a pageant exclusive to natural born female that is a social movement and an empowering decision, but when a woman competes for a transgender pageant, a trans community cry foul. Very primitive self centered thinking
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby chorr » Sat Jun 30, 2018 5:11 pm

cindy kurletopz 2 wrote:I am a gay man and i do not agree to a transgender woman competing for a pageant inclusive to female by birth and by dna. this is not about gender segregation this is about respect beyond gender labeling and teritorial arena. When a transgender competes for a pageant exclusive to natural born female that is a social movement and an empowering decision, but when a woman competes for a transgender pageant, a trans community cry foul. Very primitive self centered thinking


Let me ask this once and for all, WHEN DID A NATURAL BORN WOMAN WANTED TO COMPETE IN TRANS PAGEANT? I NEED RECEIPTS!

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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby Beta » Sat Jun 30, 2018 5:37 pm

IMHO, it's one thing to disagree, it's another to disrespect.

I've seen some ugly things here in an effort to champion sides, but it ends up cheapening their own cause.

It's a basic right to be respected. It'll do some people good to walk a mile in somebody else's shoes.
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby The Duchess » Sat Jun 30, 2018 6:27 pm

Beta wrote:IMHO, it's one thing to disagree, it's another to disrespect.

I've seen some ugly things here in an effort to champion sides, but it ends up cheapening their own cause.

It's a basic right to be respected. It'll do some people good to walk a mile in somebody else's shoes.



Too many people disrespecting their own community
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby lucy » Sat Jun 30, 2018 6:48 pm

BUT STILL TRANSGENDERS WERE BORN AS MEN! 8-} , THERE ARE A LOT OF PAGEANTS FOR TRANSGENDERS, THEY SHOULD RESPECT PAGEANTS FOR NATURAL BORN WOMEN, NOTHING AGAINST THEM SINCE I HAVE FRIENDS WHO ARE TRANS AS WELL, BUT PLEASE DON'T CROSS THE LINE! :)>-
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby The Duchess » Sat Jun 30, 2018 7:47 pm

lucy wrote:BUT STILL TRANSGENDERS WERE BORN AS MEN! 8-} , THERE ARE A LOT OF PAGEANTS FOR TRANSGENDERS, THEY SHOULD RESPECT PAGEANTS FOR NATURAL BORN WOMEN, NOTHING AGAINST THEM SINCE I HAVE FRIENDS WHO ARE TRANS AS WELL, BUT PLEASE DON'T CROSS THE LINE! :)>-


She wants to be a Miss Universe and the Miss Universe allows it, also name me one trans pageant that is at the level of Miss Universe? We are acting as if she is wrong for wanting to be in a top level pageant, its not her fault the Miss Universe allows it.
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby Smile » Sat Jun 30, 2018 7:57 pm

The Duchess wrote:
lucy wrote:BUT STILL TRANSGENDERS WERE BORN AS MEN! 8-} , THERE ARE A LOT OF PAGEANTS FOR TRANSGENDERS, THEY SHOULD RESPECT PAGEANTS FOR NATURAL BORN WOMEN, NOTHING AGAINST THEM SINCE I HAVE FRIENDS WHO ARE TRANS AS WELL, BUT PLEASE DON'T CROSS THE LINE! :)>-


She wants to be a Miss Universe and the Miss Universe allows it, also name me one trans pageant that is at the level of Miss Universe? We are acting as if she is wrong for wanting to be in a top level pageant, its not her fault the Miss Universe allows it.


It's neither's fault. She has every right to compete and Miss Universe has every right to allow it. Plain and simple. Miss Universe will allow her to compete and they will welcome her with open arms. For those who don't like it, they can simply not watch or support Miss Universe.

One can never give in to the ignorant. History has shown us that ignorant people will bitch and moan but they either learn to accept change or live on the fringes of society.
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby The Duchess » Sat Jun 30, 2018 8:01 pm

Smile wrote:
The Duchess wrote:
lucy wrote:BUT STILL TRANSGENDERS WERE BORN AS MEN! 8-} , THERE ARE A LOT OF PAGEANTS FOR TRANSGENDERS, THEY SHOULD RESPECT PAGEANTS FOR NATURAL BORN WOMEN, NOTHING AGAINST THEM SINCE I HAVE FRIENDS WHO ARE TRANS AS WELL, BUT PLEASE DON'T CROSS THE LINE! :)>-


She wants to be a Miss Universe and the Miss Universe allows it, also name me one trans pageant that is at the level of Miss Universe? We are acting as if she is wrong for wanting to be in a top level pageant, its not her fault the Miss Universe allows it.


It's neither's fault. She has every right to compete and Miss Universe has every right to allow it. Plain and simple. Miss Universe will allow her to compete and they will welcome her with open arms. For those who don't like it, they can simply not watch or support Miss Universe.

One can never give in to the ignorant. History has shown us that ignorant people will bitch and moan but they either learn to accept change or live on the fringes of society.


I wanna know when the hell did pageant fans got the idea that pageants and private organizations owe them anything, they have their own rules and you choose to follow the pageant you agree. Progress cannot simply stop because it makes some people mad.
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby manoypoe » Sat Jun 30, 2018 8:03 pm

NOT AMUSING. IT FEELS AWKWARD. IT'S WEIRD. BUT SO BE IT. =O/ =O/
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby Smile » Sat Jun 30, 2018 8:11 pm

The Duchess wrote:
Smile wrote:
The Duchess wrote:
lucy wrote:BUT STILL TRANSGENDERS WERE BORN AS MEN! 8-} , THERE ARE A LOT OF PAGEANTS FOR TRANSGENDERS, THEY SHOULD RESPECT PAGEANTS FOR NATURAL BORN WOMEN, NOTHING AGAINST THEM SINCE I HAVE FRIENDS WHO ARE TRANS AS WELL, BUT PLEASE DON'T CROSS THE LINE! :)>-


She wants to be a Miss Universe and the Miss Universe allows it, also name me one trans pageant that is at the level of Miss Universe? We are acting as if she is wrong for wanting to be in a top level pageant, its not her fault the Miss Universe allows it.


It's neither's fault. She has every right to compete and Miss Universe has every right to allow it. Plain and simple. Miss Universe will allow her to compete and they will welcome her with open arms. For those who don't like it, they can simply not watch or support Miss Universe.

One can never give in to the ignorant. History has shown us that ignorant people will bitch and moan but they either learn to accept change or live on the fringes of society.


I wanna know when the hell did pageant fans got the idea that pageants and private organizations owe them anything, they have their own rules and you choose to follow the pageant you agree. Progress cannot simply stop because it makes some people mad.


Absolutely.

A lot of research and thought goes into these decisions. IMG didn't wake up one morning and decided to just allow transgenders to compete. They spent much time deliberating and part of that process is dealing with the potential backlash. IMG is prepared. They realize that they may lose some fans, but they also realize that it's their responsibility to evolve with the times. The pros far outweigh the cons.
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby Agnes Rosenberg » Sat Jun 30, 2018 8:23 pm

Be careful who you hate. It could be someone you love.

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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby Sallaberry86 » Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:29 pm

Considering the Philippines has been sending MANISH looking contestants with BOTCHED SURGERIES for the last 5 years, I don't see what the big deal is??? she at least has a waistline and a more FEMININE BODY THAN CUNTriona? LMAO!!!!
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby Agnes Rosenberg » Sun Jul 01, 2018 8:31 am

novemberRain wrote:Transphobia? Transs have their own pageants, if he insists to compete and won Miss Universe 2018, you make beauty pageant image is getting worst especially in my country, Miss Universe is well known for natural born women, YOU DISGRACE YOURSELF BECAUSE YOU RUIN OUR TRADITION.

HAVE ANY TRANSGENDER DO SOMETHING BAD TO YOU?
FROM WHERE DOES YOUR HATE COMING FROM? @-) =O/ @-)


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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby MAGNETO » Sun Jul 01, 2018 9:08 am

I am with you Agnes.
Lets RISE ABOVE HATE :-*
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby XerxesBreik » Sun Jul 01, 2018 5:27 pm

Live and let live. I would have expected these narrow thinking from homophobes, not from people who are part of the LGBT themselves.

Some of you are saying that we should respect tradition that has been in placed for decades already, but let me just remind you that it used to be a tradition that women don't get to vote, and that blacks are slave, and that being gay is a mental illness. If you're so narrow-minded that you think traditions should remain unchanged even though through time it's been proven to be inhumane, then shame on you.
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby davidtbv » Sun Jul 01, 2018 5:42 pm

Theres 2 type of female

1. Cisgender female
2. Transgender female

Miss Universe is for female (cisgender female and transgender female)

Angela Ponce is a transgender female or in short female

Case close, she is qualified to join Miss Universe
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Re: CULTURAL RELATIVISM and TRANSEXUALISM in PAGEANTRY

Postby manoypoe » Mon Jul 02, 2018 4:50 am

XerxesBreik wrote:Live and let live. I would have expected these narrow thinking from homophobes, not from people who are part of the LGBT themselves.

Some of you are saying that we should respect tradition that has been in placed for decades already, but let me just remind you that it used to be a tradition that women don't get to vote, and that blacks are slave, and that being gay is a mental illness. If you're so narrow-minded that you think traditions should remain unchanged even though through time it's been proven to be inhumane, then shame on you.


ANYHOW, LET US HOPE THAT THE 'TRADITION' IS ALSO CHANGED THAT ONLY NATURAL BORN WOMAN CAN GIVE BIRTH. WHO KNOWS, ONE DAY A TRANSWOMAN CAN GIVE BIRTH TOO. :%)) :%))
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